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MACEDONIA VOTES 2009 - UPDATE - IVANOV & FRCKOVSKI INTO 2ND ROUND



National.

George Ivanov from the main ruling VMRO DPMNE party and Ljubomir Frckoski from the main opposition the Social Democrats are set to go into the second round of Macedonia’s presidential election according to early results.
Out of 37 percent of the counted votes, Ivanov is the frontrunner with about 81,000 votes or 37 percent while Frckoski has won 43,000 votes or nearly 20 percent, according to the State Election Commission.

The independent candidate Ljube Boskoski got 36,000 votes or 16 percent, Imer Selmani from the New Democracy party received 29,000 votes or 13 percent, while Agron Buxhaku from the ruling Democratic Union for Integration, DUI got 16,000 votes or over 6 percent.

Mirushe Hoxha from the Democratic Party of Albanians, DPA and Nano Ruzin from the Liberal Democrats won around 7,000 votes each or around 3 percent from the number of ballots counted so far.

Earlier the State Election Commission announced Sunday’s presidential and mayoral elections went without major incident and met democratic norms.

In what was widely seen as a curtail test for the country’s shaken democratic record only the heavy snow disrupted the election with ballot materials unable to reach some remote mountainous areas on time.

But overall the election went "peacefully and in a democratic atmosphere with minor exceptions," the State Election Commission head, Aleksandar Novakovski said at a press conference.

The snow prevented some 12,000 people in certain mountainous vilages, less than one percent of the total voters, to vote as the balloting did not start in 103 out of the nearly 3000 ballot stations, the commission said.

The largest association of domestic monitors, MOST also assessed the vote as generally fair and democratic with few minor, mainly technical and administrative flaws. They have been monitoring the process with over 3000 observers out of almost 7,500 present at the ballots. The police presence was also evident at all ballot stations.

The election is being closely monitored in the West which has previously warned the country that it could face years of delay in its bid to join the European Union if there is a repeat of last year’s election-related violence. In June 2008, violence erupted between rival ethnic Albanian parties during the vote leaving one person dead and several wounded.

In statements given prior to the closing of the vote, the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe, the largest international monitoring group, and the key western ambassadors to the country also expressed that they were content with the way the elections were held.

If none of the seven presidential candidates wins more than half of the votes in the first round a run-off will be staged on April 5 between the two front-runners. The same applies for the 84 mayoral seats.

(Photo credit should read A1)


MD: The picture is from 23.20 hours. percentage may vary with the released results by State election commission.



[Binsight]

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2,300 years later, 'Alexander-mania' grips Macedonia
Much to the anger of Greece, the ancient conqueror is making a big comeback in Macedonia – he's arriving just in time for Sunday's election.
SKOPJE, Macedonia - As part of a stunning new homegrown ideology of history and identity based on Alexander the Great, this capital city's main square may soon boast a huge new statue of the ancient conqueror.

Two years ago, the national airport was renamed after Alexander, infuriating Greece.

In January, despite a recent Greek nixing of Macedonia's NATO bid over the airport name, the ruling nationalists here changed the name of its main roadway to Alexander of Macedon Highway.

In Macedonia, it is becoming all Alexander the Great, all the time. Ahead of Sunday's presidential elections, the ruling party's Alexander ideology is seen as fantastic, even by Balkan standards.

In an intense media campaign, locals are told that ethnic Macedonians are the proud direct descendants of Alexander, and thus a people responsible for spawning the white race of planet Earth, from the Caucasus "to the seas off Japan," according to a public service spot on national TV.

The "Alexander-mania," as critics call it, is partly a vote-getting strategy by the ruling party, known by its initials VMRO. Doubts exist as to whether party leaders actually believe the claims, but they are being sold as truth. The failure last spring to get a clear NATO invitation prompted fury in Skopje, and the Alexander campaign is seen as an effort to up the ante.

By pushing its thumb further into the already sore eye of Greece, both NATO and EU membership for the small, landlocked state remains in limbo. Macedonia is also distracted from reducing tensions with its sizable Albanian minority community following a brief ethnic war in 2001, diplomats say.

The dispute with Greece, largely unchanged since 1991, centers on a fight over the use of "Macedonia" as the country's name. Greece wants a name that doesn't include or at least deemphasizes "Macedonia," which Greeks say is their own. The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia says its name is its own sovereign business. Negotiations have been endless.

For years, Greek demands were seen as cock-eyed and petty in diplomatic circles. Yet Macedonia has been losing sympathy as it roars out heritage claims on Alexander.

"If the name is the condition of our survival, which it seems to be, we are very far from reaching our strategic aims: NATO and the EU," says former Macedonian Foreign Minister Denko Maleski. "The new way of thinking about history is keeping tensions alive. We are a new nation, liberal and international, suddenly veering into the 19th century."

A poll last month showed that 97 percent of ethnic Macedonians favored staying out of the EU if it meant compromising on the name.

"The name dispute is more than a bilateral issue between Skopje and Athens. It risks derailing the main strategy of both NATO and the EU for stabilizing Macedonia," says a recent report from the International Crisis Group.

Some diplomats frame Sunday's elections as a vote for a president who may push Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski for a name resolution versus a nationalist who would not. Right now, it appears that VMRO's George Ivanov, an architect of the Alexander discourse, is set to win big. The opposition is in disarray, and Macedonia could end up with a one-party state.

"The entire nationalism hysteria, which only few question as most media get huge sums of money through government advertising, serves not only as a distraction from serious problems ... but has created an atmosphere that makes compromise difficult. It reminds me a bit of the madness of Serbia in the '90s, though not on the same scale, when Serbs spoke of themselves as 'the heavenly people,' " says Ana Petruseva, managing editor of Balkan Insight, in Skopje.

Indee, Macedonia's bold claim to be the taproot of Western civilization is daily media fare.

Last summer, the government flew in members of Pakistan's Hunza tribe, considered lost descendants of Alexander, to tour the country. Startled and pleased Hunza were greeted at Alexander airport with flowers and treated like long lost cousins as they disported across the nation, cameras in tow.

Even "God" has gotten involved. A nine-minute TV ad starts with a petition from Macedonia to the heavens: "Our neighbors distributed thousands of books across the world, containing false history and portraying a wrong picture about Macedonia. ... Only you know our pain." The Almighty then responds: "From you, Macedonians, descendants of Macedon, I conceived the white race. All that stretches to the seas off Japan is conceived from your genes."

Sinisa-Jakov Marusic, a columnist for Balkan Insight, cheekily observed, "So there you have it! What better proof than God himself?"

Beyond theatrics, the new program deeply troubles many scholars and intellectuals here – who are being sidelined – for its promulgation of myth as truth. The new taxpayer-funded Alexander ideology has no serious texts.

Unlike Serbia's Kosovo story, based on centuries of poetry and legend, the Macedonian ideology is being both invented and presented at the same time. There is no outside scholarly consensus, no textual tradition; the result is a kind of history-free history. The top-down, debate-free imposition of the new history is itself seen as illiberal and authoritarian.

The new program deeply troubles many scholars here. "What is the content of 'Alexanderization?'" asks Irena Stefoska, a Byzantine scholar at the Institute of National History here. "Who knows? It is a new reading of history completely different from the previous, not done from an academic point of view, but from a purely political view."

Alexander is considered one of the greatest military leaders of all time. Born in the Greek city of Pella in 356 BC, his conquests extended to most of his known world by the time of his death at age 32. He opened up Greek civilization from the Mediterranean to India, and is regarded as the first to link Europe, Asia, and Africa.

"Alexander was the captain general of all the Hellenes. He spoke Greek. He went to war on behalf of the Hellenes. No one in the ancient, medieval, or modern world has disputed this," says Michael Wood, a historian and British filmmaker who has produced a work on Alexander and has another in the making.

"The Macedonian state claim has no basis in history; it is a state-sponsored myth. I tell my Macedonian and Greek friends to ignore it," Mr. Wood adds.

State archaeologists in Skopje and Athens, however, are busy unearthing ancient Hellenic artifacts, which are then presented as evidence of Alexander heritage. Advocates of this new history leap from the present day to ancient times, ignoring Ottoman, Slavonian, and Byzantine periods when the Balkan peoples migrated and mingled.

"The problem is that no one today can be the direct descendants of ancient civilizations," says Ms. Stefoska. "Macedonians are Slavs. Our Slavonic heritage is accepted by historians."

Several years ago, VMRO officials claimed that Macedonia's majority population had an ethnic Bulgarian or Slavic origin.

A chief fear here is a scenario of partition – of north Kosovo Serbs in the Mitrovica area joining Serbia proper, which could push Macedonian and Kosovar Albanians into a union, breaking up Macedonia.

So far, ethnic Albanians here have been patient over the Macedonia-Greece dispute. Albanian parties are in the ruling coalition. Yet the patience may not be unlimited, senior diplomats say.

Artan Grubi, head of an Albanian civil society organization, says, "Most Albanians will tell you they have nothing against building a Macedonian identity. But they don't want to suffer because of it. At the moment, the policies of this government are moving us further from Europe."

http://www.csmonitor.com/2009/0321/p01s01-wogn.html

By Robert Marquand
2,300 years later, 'Alexander-mania' grips Macedonia
Much to the anger of Greece, the ancient conqueror is making a big comeback in Macedonia – he's arriving just in time for Sunday's election.
SKOPJE, Macedonia - As part of a stunning new homegrown ideology of history and identity based on Alexander the Great, this capital city's main square may soon boast a huge new statue of the ancient conqueror.

Two years ago, the national airport was renamed after Alexander, infuriating Greece.

In January, despite a recent Greek nixing of Macedonia's NATO bid over the airport name, the ruling nationalists here changed the name of its main roadway to Alexander of Macedon Highway.

In Macedonia, it is becoming all Alexander the Great, all the time. Ahead of Sunday's presidential elections, the ruling party's Alexander ideology is seen as fantastic, even by Balkan standards.

In an intense media campaign, locals are told that ethnic Macedonians are the proud direct descendants of Alexander, and thus a people responsible for spawning the white race of planet Earth, from the Caucasus "to the seas off Japan," according to a public service spot on national TV.

The "Alexander-mania," as critics call it, is partly a vote-getting strategy by the ruling party, known by its initials VMRO. Doubts exist as to whether party leaders actually believe the claims, but they are being sold as truth. The failure last spring to get a clear NATO invitation prompted fury in Skopje, and the Alexander campaign is seen as an effort to up the ante.

By pushing its thumb further into the already sore eye of Greece, both NATO and EU membership for the small, landlocked state remains in limbo. Macedonia is also distracted from reducing tensions with its sizable Albanian minority community following a brief ethnic war in 2001, diplomats say.

The dispute with Greece, largely unchanged since 1991, centers on a fight over the use of "Macedonia" as the country's name. Greece wants a name that doesn't include or at least deemphasizes "Macedonia," which Greeks say is their own. The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia says its name is its own sovereign business. Negotiations have been endless.

For years, Greek demands were seen as cock-eyed and petty in diplomatic circles. Yet Macedonia has been losing sympathy as it roars out heritage claims on Alexander.

"If the name is the condition of our survival, which it seems to be, we are very far from reaching our strategic aims: NATO and the EU," says former Macedonian Foreign Minister Denko Maleski. "The new way of thinking about history is keeping tensions alive. We are a new nation, liberal and international, suddenly veering into the 19th century."

A poll last month showed that 97 percent of ethnic Macedonians favored staying out of the EU if it meant compromising on the name.

"The name dispute is more than a bilateral issue between Skopje and Athens. It risks derailing the main strategy of both NATO and the EU for stabilizing Macedonia," says a recent report from the International Crisis Group.

Some diplomats frame Sunday's elections as a vote for a president who may push Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski for a name resolution versus a nationalist who would not. Right now, it appears that VMRO's George Ivanov, an architect of the Alexander discourse, is set to win big. The opposition is in disarray, and Macedonia could end up with a one-party state.

"The entire nationalism hysteria, which only few question as most media get huge sums of money through government advertising, serves not only as a distraction from serious problems ... but has created an atmosphere that makes compromise difficult. It reminds me a bit of the madness of Serbia in the '90s, though not on the same scale, when Serbs spoke of themselves as 'the heavenly people,' " says Ana Petruseva, managing editor of Balkan Insight, in Skopje.

Indee, Macedonia's bold claim to be the taproot of Western civilization is daily media fare.

Last summer, the government flew in members of Pakistan's Hunza tribe, considered lost descendants of Alexander, to tour the country. Startled and pleased Hunza were greeted at Alexander airport with flowers and treated like long lost cousins as they disported across the nation, cameras in tow.

Even "God" has gotten involved. A nine-minute TV ad starts with a petition from Macedonia to the heavens: "Our neighbors distributed thousands of books across the world, containing false history and portraying a wrong picture about Macedonia. ... Only you know our pain." The Almighty then responds: "From you, Macedonians, descendants of Macedon, I conceived the white race. All that stretches to the seas off Japan is conceived from your genes."

Sinisa-Jakov Marusic, a columnist for Balkan Insight, cheekily observed, "So there you have it! What better proof than God himself?"

Beyond theatrics, the new program deeply troubles many scholars and intellectuals here – who are being sidelined – for its promulgation of myth as truth. The new taxpayer-funded Alexander ideology has no serious texts.

Unlike Serbia's Kosovo story, based on centuries of poetry and legend, the Macedonian ideology is being both invented and presented at the same time. There is no outside scholarly consensus, no textual tradition; the result is a kind of history-free history. The top-down, debate-free imposition of the new history is itself seen as illiberal and authoritarian.

The new program deeply troubles many scholars here. "What is the content of 'Alexanderization?'" asks Irena Stefoska, a Byzantine scholar at the Institute of National History here. "Who knows? It is a new reading of history completely different from the previous, not done from an academic point of view, but from a purely political view."

Alexander is considered one of the greatest military leaders of all time. Born in the Greek city of Pella in 356 BC, his conquests extended to most of his known world by the time of his death at age 32. He opened up Greek civilization from the Mediterranean to India, and is regarded as the first to link Europe, Asia, and Africa.

"Alexander was the captain general of all the Hellenes. He spoke Greek. He went to war on behalf of the Hellenes. No one in the ancient, medieval, or modern world has disputed this," says Michael Wood, a historian and British filmmaker who has produced a work on Alexander and has another in the making.

"The Macedonian state claim has no basis in history; it is a state-sponsored myth. I tell my Macedonian and Greek friends to ignore it," Mr. Wood adds.

State archaeologists in Skopje and Athens, however, are busy unearthing ancient Hellenic artifacts, which are then presented as evidence of Alexander heritage. Advocates of this new history leap from the present day to ancient times, ignoring Ottoman, Slavonian, and Byzantine periods when the Balkan peoples migrated and mingled.

"The problem is that no one today can be the direct descendants of ancient civilizations," says Ms. Stefoska. "Macedonians are Slavs. Our Slavonic heritage is accepted by historians."

Several years ago, VMRO officials claimed that Macedonia's majority population had an ethnic Bulgarian or Slavic origin.

A chief fear here is a scenario of partition – of north Kosovo Serbs in the Mitrovica area joining Serbia proper, which could push Macedonian and Kosovar Albanians into a union, breaking up Macedonia.

So far, ethnic Albanians here have been patient over the Macedonia-Greece dispute. Albanian parties are in the ruling coalition. Yet the patience may not be unlimited, senior diplomats say.

Artan Grubi, head of an Albanian civil society organization, says, "Most Albanians will tell you they have nothing against building a Macedonian identity. But they don't want to suffer because of it. At the moment, the policies of this government are moving us further from Europe."

http://www.csmonitor.com/2009/0321/p01s01-wogn.html

MACEDONIA IS 4 THE MACEDONIANS

MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK
MACEDONIA IS NOT GREEK


THE WORD GREECE WAS NEVER USED IN ALEXANDER THE GREATES TIME. THE WORD GREECE WAS CREATED IN THE 1830

MACEDONIA WAS NEVER PART OF GREEK HISTORY. EVEN TURKY HAS MORE RIGHTS IN MACEDONIA THEN THE GREEKS. MACEDONIA IS ONE OF THE OLDEST NAMES IN HISTORY.

AND THE NAME CAN NEVER BE CHANGED.

I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU SLAV!!!!!!!!

ΜΑΚΕΔΟΝΙΑ,

THIS GREEK NAME (HELLINIKON TO BE MORE PRECISE)IS ONE OF THE OLDEST IN THE WORLD AS THE GREEK LANGUAGE...
I BET YOU CAN NOT READ IT!!!!
AND I BET YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT DOES IT MEAN!!! AS IT IS GREEK!!!!

To 334 π.Χ. μετά από σκληρή μάχη στο Γρανικό ποταμό ο Αλέξανδρος έστειλε τα λάφυρα της μάχης ως αφιέρωμα στον Παρθενώνα της Αθήνας, τη μητρόπολη του Ελληνικού Κόσμου με την παραπάνω αναθηματική επιγραφή. Χιλιάδες χρόνια μετά και περίπου μία εκατονταετία πριν να έρθουν κάποιοι φωστήρες να μας εξιστορήσουν μία νέα εκδοχή της ιστορίας, που ξέραμε, ο Κωνσταντίνος Καβάφης έγραψε ένα αξεπέραστο ποίημα που μετουσιώνει τη συλλογική συνείδηση του Ελληνικού Κόσμου μέσα στο πέρασμα των αιώνων.

«Aλέξανδρος Φιλίππου και οι Έλληνες πλην Λακεδαιμονίων—»

Μπορούμε κάλλιστα να φαντασθούμε
πως θ’ αδιαφόρησαν παντάπασι στην Σπάρτη
για την επιγραφήν αυτή. «Πλην Λακεδαιμονίων»,
μα φυσικά. Δεν ήσαν οι Σπαρτιάται
για να τους οδηγούν και για να τους προστάζουν
σαν πολυτίμους υπηρέτας. Άλλωστε
μια πανελλήνια εκστρατεία χωρίς
Σπαρτιάτη βασιλέα γι’ αρχηγό
δεν θα τους φαίνονταν πολλής περιωπής.
A βεβαιότατα «πλην Λακεδαιμονίων».

Είναι κι αυτή μια στάσις. Νοιώθεται.
Έτσι, πλην Λακεδαιμονίων στον Γρανικό·
και στην Ισσό μετά· και στην τελειωτική
την μάχη, όπου εσαρώθη ο φοβερός στρατός
που στ’ Άρβηλα συγκέντρωσαν οι Πέρσαι:
που απ’ τ’ Άρβηλα ξεκίνησε για νίκην, κ’ εσαρώθη.

Κι απ’ την θαυμάσια πανελλήνιαν εκστρατεία,
την νικηφόρα, την περίλαμπρη,
την περιλάλητη, την δοξασμένη
ως άλλη δεν δοξάσθηκε καμιά,
την απαράμιλλη: βγήκαμ’ εμείς·
ελληνικός καινούριος κόσμος, μέγας.

Εμείς· οι Aλεξανδρείς, οι Aντιοχείς,
οι Σελευκείς, κ’ οι πολυάριθμοι
επίλοιποι Έλληνες Aιγύπτου και Συρίας,
κ’ οι εν Μηδία, κ’ οι εν Περσίδι, κι όσοι άλλοι.
Με τες εκτεταμένες επικράτειες,
με την ποικίλη δράσι των στοχαστικών προσαρμογών.
Και την Κοινήν Ελληνική Λαλιά
ώς μέσα στην Βακτριανή την πήγαμεν, ώς τους Ινδούς.

Για Λακεδαιμονίους να μιλούμε τώρα!

I BET SLAVS OR BULGARIANS OR WHATEVER YOU ARE, YOU CANNOT READ IT, AS IT IS WRITTEN IN MACEDONIAN=GREEK!

Don't worry, your grandparents couldn't read it either. They had to be taught the athenian language when they were first transplanted from anatolia.

Your 'slav' argument is lightweight, as all educated people would know that there is no such thing as an ethnic slav. 'Slav' is a linguistical group. Our Macedonian language belongs to the slavic family of languages, and our ethnicity is, and always will be Macedonian.

So back to your arvanitoturkovlach hideout and come up with something with more substance.

Greetings,
Your Macedonian friend

hey Greeks if Alexander the Great is Greek how come only the Greek Language is spoken in Greece and not in the rest of the World like the Slavic Language is spoken in blugeria,serbia,slovania,crotia,
poland,russia,bosnia,hungry, and most of europe have slavic dilects see our language is wide spread. so Alexander the great cant be greek because he ruled most of the world and his language would have been spoken in most of the countrys but your country only speaks greeks so you say. but we all no that in greece there are larg Macedonian Population and trukish,Vlah,bulgerian, that you claim dont exist how can a country that was ruled by turkey for 500 years not to have a single turk. how can a country that was ruled by the Vlhas not have a Vlah People living in the country how can a country that was ruled by Macedonians not have a Macedonian.

IF ALEXANDER THE GREAT SPREAD HELLENIC AROUND THE WORLD HE DIDNT DO A GOOD JOB BECAUSE NO OTHER COUNTRY AROUND THE WORLD SPEAKS GREEK. BUT A LOT OF COUNTRYS AROUND THE WORLD SPEAK SLAVIC.

slavhellenic hahahahahha

So what, are you implying that Alexander spoke a Slavic language even though Slavs came to this area 900 years after him? The official spoken language of the Macedonian empire was the Greek Koine and the thousands of findings from Greece to India written in Greek testify it but Alexander let the conquered peoples use their own languages and dialects.As for your question if Greek is widespread , know that almost 20% of the English vocabulary derives from Greek,most scientific terms used around the world are Greek so Greek is prety widespread even today when Greece is past it's former glory. Besides the Slavic alphabet was created by Byzantine Greeks and you can easily see the similarities.

Greek Greek that's all you fxxxen think. There have been other s before you greeks or shouId I say Geek's. You better start reading up on world history.

LoLLlllllllllllllllllll
We are not discussing the fact if you have any connection with our ancestor Alexander and the Macedonians.... YOU HAVE NOT AT ALL!!!
More connection have the COWS of Egypt than You!
This is well known as YOUR President Gligorov stated: WE ARE SLAVS, NO CONNECTION WITH ANCIENT MACEDONIA!!!
We just remind YOU that have NO CONNECTION with Geographical Macedonia either! As it is a Geographical part of Greece!!!
Sleep in Peace Albanoslavobulgarian citizens of the Unknown State of FYROM?
We Macedonians and the rest of the Greeks are Watching uppon YOU!

Albanoslavobulgarians and the rest of turkeys, roms etc, (note: we appreciate all of these ethnic groups)citizens of whatever State, watch another historical sourse of the old testament:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90w-k73jsr4

the original Macedonians are the Vlahs and The Slavs.

listen mate your language was created in the 1830 by the ancient language of the (Koine) that was found by latin student that was studing in Germany. and that language was forced to be used in the region because the west was trying to keep russia out so they formed a fabricated state and called it greece and even desinged the flag with the cross on it there nothing ancheint about the greek flag. nothing to do with ancient history. the ancient Atheians where Irianians, Irianians are now Known as Albanians. Alexander the Greats Mum was an Albanian and Alexander the Greats Farther is Macedonian. the Irianians from Athens where forced to learn a new language and adopt a new formed state. because this was a plan by the westen powers at the time to unite everyone in the region to keep russia out.

History is history- you all have to move on to the 21st century.
Greek's you have to stop this bullship towards your neighbour. The world knows you are very Greek and will not give in . Macedonia is Macedonia, Turkey is Turkey, England is England, Ireland is Ireland and Scotland is Scotland get the picture. Not Greek and not Macedonian. Fed upXXXX

The world knows that Macedonia is the N. part of Greece!
And FYROM IS FYROM!
Is just a Former Yugaslavia Something!
This is the official name of this Clone State, until they decide what name they want to be called with!...
The History is well known from All, and won't be change...
The Clown State Has Already a Big Enemy and is working for New Ones...

THE SKOPJEN GOD, THE GOD OF THE MAKENOIDEN (They call themeselves something similar...)

HAS APPEARED THE ELECTION DAY AND MADE A MIRACLE JUST FOR THEM!!!

OH GOD ALMIGHTY, THANK YOU FOR YOUR ATTENTION IN THE FYROMIAN BABYLON!

FOR LAUGHT JUST READ THE REST...

ΔΙΑΒΑΣΤΕ ΚΑΙ ΓΕΛΑΣΤΕ... ΠΩΣ Ο ΘΕΟΣ ΠΟΛΛΑΠΛΑΣΙΑΣΕ ΤΟΥΣ ΣΚΟΠΙΑΝΟΥΣ ΓΙΑ ΤΙΣ ΜΕΡΕΣ ΤΩΝ ΕΚΛΟΓΩΝ!

http://macedonia-greece.blogspot.com/2009/03/blog-post_26.html

listen Greeks you have no idea im A Vlah Macedonian and i Have a lot of family in Greece and i know very well the pupulation of my people we have 2.5 Million Vlahs in Greece and we are forced to speak it all my family have greek sernames. but before 1913 they had Vlah Macedonian names. the Vlah people are the first Macedonians in the Byz Times People just gave us the name as Vlahs like Australians call the English Poms and Newzealanders qiwis its just a slang name when the bzyn people gave us. the Vlah people in Macedonia a like the Aboriginals in Australia we are the first. to live on this land.

MAKEDONIJA MAKEDONIJA MAKEDONIJA

RUSTI VISOKO DRVO RISJANSKO

The responce of KIRO GLIGOROV, the first President of FYROM, to the Makenoides (God call them something similar...)
http://edo-makedonia.pblogs.gr/2009/03/symbibasmo-me-thn-ellada-zhtaei-kai-shmera-o-kiro-gkligkorof.html

The responce of KIRO GLIGOROV, the first President of FYROM, to the Makenoides or Malakoides (God call them something similar...)
http://edo-makedonia.pblogs.gr/2009/03/symbibasmo-me-thn-ellada-zhtaei-kai-shmera-o-kiro-gkligkorof.html

Ancient Macedonia: Their Objective ContentIt appears that propaganda from FYROM does not reflects even in Wikipedia projects in Slavic languages. Although it is certain that the teams of authors who worked on them were well aware of the so-called “arguments” which are systematically exported from FYROM, on all of Wikipedia Slavic websites objectivity has been placed forward and sustained.
____________________________________
Polish

http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starożytna_Macedonia

“Starożytni Macedończycy byli spokrewnieni z Grekami, którzy jednak zaliczali ich do barbarzyńców. Mimo to dopuszczali Macedończyków do igrzysk olimpijskich. W odróżnieniu od większości greckich państw Macedonia była monarchią”.

“Ancient Macedonians were of the same race as Greeks, who once compared them to barbarians. Regardless of that, they allowed Macedonians into the Olympic Games. In comparisons from the majority of Greek states Macedonia was a monarchy”.
____________________________________
Czech

http://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starověká_Makedonie

“Někteří historikové označují Makedonce za potomky několika různých národů – Frygů, Thráků a Ilyrů – nemajících žádné vazby na Řeky. Avšak většina moderních vědců se kloní k názoru, že Makedonce je třeba považovat za jeden z řeckých kmenů”.

“Few historians consider Macedonians to be descendants of several various people-Brygians, Thracian and Illyrians, having no relations to Greece. Nevertheless, the majority of present-day scholars is inclined to the view that Macedonians should be considered for one of the Greek entities.”

_____________________________________
Russian

ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Древняя_Македония

«Греческое» или «эллинское» происхождение древних македонян оспаривается в одностороннем порядке современным государством Македония. Понятия «эллин» и «македонянин» принято различать, подразумевая основание Македонии как отдельного государства мигрировавшими греками.

“Greek”or “Hellenic” ancestry of ancient Macedonians is denied into the one-sided order of today’s modern state of Macedonia. (Although) the terms “Hellene” and “Macedonian” are sometimes different, it is understood that Macedonia is founded as a separate state of migrating Greeks.

_____________________________________
Slovak

http://sk.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedónia_(historické_územie)

“Macedónia zostávala storočia na periférii gréckeho sveta”.

“Macedonia was a backward area on the periphery of Greek world”.

“Miestny jazyk (staroveká macedónčina) bol jedným zo starogréckych jazykov a pravdepodobne pochádzal zo skupiny severozápadných gréckych dialektov”.

“The native language (the ancient Macedonian) was one of the old Greek languages, and by its nature belonged to the group of northwestern Greek dialects”
_____________________________________
Serbian

http://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makedonija_(antička)

“Makedonija (od grč. Μακεδονία) je bio naziv antičkog kraljevstva koje se nalazilo na najsevernijem delu antičke Grčke, koje se na zapadu graničilo s Epirom, a na istoku s Trakijom”.

“Macedonia (from Gr. Μακεδονία) was the name of an ancient kingdom which was located at the northernmost part of ancient Greece, which was bordered by Epirus at the west and with Thrace at the East”.

Krste Misirkov : Slav Macedonians identified as "Slavs" and "Macedonians with geographical definition"

Krste Misirkov in his book "On Macedonian matters" (Chapter:Can Macedonia turn itself into a separate ethnographical and political unit? Has it already done so? Is it doing so now?) was clear as about the ethnical identification of the Slav Macedonians and theirs language:


If the formation of the South Slav peoples was a mechanical and political process it would not be impossible that it might recur in present times. Within the South Slav language complex there are several branches outside the Serbian and Bulgarian political units; these are the Macedonian dialects. These branches, since they are closely allied, naturally have some connection linking them more closely with Bulgarian in the east and Serbian in the north.

These branches have been given various names at various times but it was not until the last quarter of the nineteenth century that these names overlapped so much as to displace one another. These various names did not properly catch on, and gradually they began to give way until finally they were replaced by the natural description Slav" with a "Macedonian" reflection from the geographical area in which they were distributed.

The people who spoke these dialects had once been called "Slavs" and later either "Serbs" or "Bulgarians" until the rivalry between these two names made them both alien to the Macedonian Slavs, who started calling themselves after the old geographical name of their country.

The name Macedonian was first used by the Macedonian Slavs as a geographical term to indicate their origin. This name is well known to the Macedonian Slavs and all of them use it to describe themselves. Since the formation of nationalities is a political and mechanical process, all the necessary conditions exist for Macedonia to break off as an independent ethnographic region.

About the DNA test of the FYROMians here what said the president of the iGENEA institute Ms. Pazo (she is not greek!) to the Forum:

"The Ancient Macedonians were the first known inhabitants of current Macedonia(FYROM) and were not only genetically close to Greeks but also socially. But nowadays we CAN'T say that Macedonians(FYROM residents) are the original "Macedonians". The Gen-Pool of the balkan region changed heavily due to Slavic immigration, ottoman empire (...)

Current studies however, assume that the Macedonians (FYROM residents) from mountenous regions and isolated areas still have the genetic material of ancient Macedonians and are descendants of Alexander the Great. The genetic profile of Macedonians (FYROM residents) from mountenous regions and the rest of Macedonians (FYROM residents) shows very strong differences. Whereby the former show a strong similarity to the Northern Greeks and archeological findings from ancient Macedonian times."

Here is a Screenshot (in german)

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/6642/aufzeichnenqj4.jpg

Goodnight Makenoides!

To the Vlah Macedonian. Tell me more about your people. When you came to Macedonia, your origin and language before and after Greek occupation. How you live in modern Greece? How did you get that name?

What does Vlah mean. Which country is the origin etc.

To the Greek posting here go and make yourself a turkish coffee and chillout. Your propaganda b/s is not wanted here.



True Macedonian

Ihr Griechen in diesem Forum, seid ein faschitoides Volk, das einzigartig in Europa ist. Ich glaube kein anderes Land in Europa hat soviel Probleme mit jedem einzelnen Nachbarn wie ihr. Koennte es nicht auch etwas an euch liegen??? Nicht, oder?! Nein, denn ihr seid ja sowas von kultiviert und ueberlegen!! Ihr seid absolut laecherlich und mit den "FYROMIANERN" koennt ihr es ja tun, die sind ja nicht auf Augenhoehe- weder in der NATO noch in der EU. Luegt doch euch eure Geschichte so zusammen, wie es euch passt, aber lasst uns hier auf dieser Webseite in Ruhe !!!

the Vlah people are ancient roman soliders our dilect is is from rome. we speak like the italians.

and the word thress is from the ancient thressilians from rome look it up in the bible. the thressialians named it thress and then the greeks changed the name to sound greek to thressalonik the word skopje was founded by the ancient romans also they called it skupi later renamed to Skopje.

the way alexander the great use to say Solider is foic. in Vlah is also the same how do the greeks say soilder.

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February 27 2010:
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